Veteran Sheffield Council leader speaks of her final great challenge as city battles Covid-19

Coun Julie Dore is talking for the first time about what went on behind closed doors during lockdowns, Tier negotiations and conversations with Number 10.

She barely pauses for breath in two hours. There's pointed criticism of the Government and its "complex, contradictory and conflicting" lockdown rules and the earthy language she used with a senior civil servant.

"I hear something and I immediately say, ‘get Edward Lister on the phone’. I do speak bluntly with him. He's courteous but does the Government listen to what I say? No!"

Coun Dore's last lengthy interview was when she announced her retirement earlier this year.

She was due to stand down in the local elections but when they were cancelled, she stayed on through the pandemic.

Coronavirus sideswiped her just like the rest of us.

"When I look back to early March, we knew Covid was going to reach our communities but at that point people were still talking about finding a cure and didn't think it would be a problem.

"I was 60, due to retire and I had a holiday planned to see the Passion Play in Germany, which is only performed every 10 years.

"It was a really special holiday and I had saved up and been waiting years to go and I sat there thinking at least I'll be on holiday come June, it'll all be sorted by then.

"When director of public health Greg Fell spoke to full council in early March that was the reality check that this was going to last months. It quickly became apparent it was going to be quite serious for us."

The initial pressure was how the council should respond to the need and demand of communities. Even finding who was shielding was difficult as the information was fractured from GPs and hospitals.

"The first stage was responding, stepping up to deliver all the services in different ways, keeping people safe, and that was a massive achievement.

"Then we started to focus on the economic impact and how we supported businesses. People were furloughed, some were on 80 per cent of the minimum wage, some were struggling to survive and couldn't make a living.

"We wanted to get people back to work as quickly as possible but safely and following government guidance and scientific advice.

"Then came all the other issues, such as the impact on education, reopening schools was divisive, there was people's mental health, the social isolation and people being unable to access normal NHS services and appointments."

There were long days and late nights of protracted Tier 3 negotiations but it was barely in effect before being superseded by a national lockdown.

"We got very little notice of the latest lockdown, I heard a rumour on Friday but it was only a rumour, and I found out with everyone else on Saturday night.

"We are always trying to catch up with the Government and it's like that all the time with local authorities. I'm on Whatsapp constantly with the other core city council leaders."

Could those leaders have teamed up as a super Northern Powerhouse force when they were battling the Government over the Tiers?

"I believe as the North we can create synergy however what you find with the regional mayors is there are always advantages and disadvantages.

"We found that Liverpool was the first to agree its position with the government then Manchester presented its negotiations differently.

"We did share exchanges about how their negotiations were going but we had to do what was best for Sheffield and South Yorkshire."

The city had 10 days of Tier 2, 13 days of Tier 3 and we are now into what Coun Dore calls Tier 4.

"I get quite frustrated as local politicians, who live alongside their constituents and are left to explain Government restrictions that are far too complex, contradictory and conflicting.

"We had 'areas of concern', then that was replaced with Tiers which were meant to be simpler but the Tier 3 restrictions changed depending where you lived in the country.

"We need to determine the public health risk rather than it being a barter about which shops can stay open and which businesses should close. It should be based on evidence and data.

"Communication has been the most difficult part because you have to tell people about complex rule changes rapidly and then five days later something changes again."

There was criticism from the Liberal Democrats that Coun Dore wasn't visible during the pandemic and should have been the figurehead leading the city.

She disagrees. "I still believe that the right person to lead this was Greg Fell as it's imperative that people can trust him. Scientists are more important than politicians.

"The problem at a national level is we don't know which scientists to listen to as we hear from so many different ones each day from different organisations.

"Politicians do question and challenge and that's happened on a daily basis, I've had daily conversations with Greg Fell and the CEO and management team meetings every week.

"It's not up to Greg to update Labour councillors or MPs so I'm the wheels behind this and the glue keeping it all together.

"I don't accept that I haven't been visible, it's just I haven't been on the evening news."

She won't be drawn on whether she will remain as leader, simply saying: "My current term ends in May", but she's hoping for no more sequels.

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In these confusing and worrying times, local journalism is more vital than ever. Thanks to everyone who helps us ask the questions that matter by taking out a digital subscription or buying a paper. We stand together. Nancy Fielder, editor.